"Anti-Bush, and Mincing No Words:

Q & A with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez"

Lally Weymouth, Washington Post

Controversy and intrigue have swirled around Venezuela's Hugo Chavez
ever since he was elected president seven years ago and established himself
as a leftist force. Chavez's rising influence in Latin American politics,
his country's role as a major supplier of crude oil for U.S. refiners and
his close ties to Cuba's Fidel Castro have alarmed policymakers in the Bush
administration.

Last month, on his television show, the Rev. Pat Robertson
actually went so far as to suggest the United States should assassinate the
51-year-old Chavez. (Robertson later apologized.)

While Chavez was in New York last week for the gathering of world
leaders at the United Nations, he sat down with Newsweek–Washington Post's
Lally Weymouth. He spelled his dislike for the Bush administration and
described himself as a revolutionary. Dressed in a bright red shirt, he
noted that he was planning to stop in Havana on his way home so that he
could spend several hours talking with Castro.

Excerpts:

Q: The opposition in Venezuela feels that it has no space. The leaders of
Sumate [a group that supported a referendum vote on Chavez two years ago]
say you indicted them for receiving money from the U.S. National Endowment
for Democracy. Why?

Chavez: You cannot forget that this very opposition governed Venezuela between
1958 and 1998. If they feel like they have no space, it is because they have
been cooked in their own sauce. Between 1958 and 1998, Venezuela fell apart.
We ended the 20th century with poverty as we have never seen it. The economy
was totally destroyed. . . . Millions of Venezuelans were without education,
health care, jobs, housing. So if they feel they do not have any room to
act, it's their own fault.

But they have many rights: the right to demonstrate, the right to
participate in elections. The opposition is utterly divided. The
revolutionary forces are totally united. Recently, we had elections. We won
90 percent.Q: You have said that the U.S. is the most evil country in the world and
you have called it a terrorist state. Do you want to have relations with the
U.S.?

Chavez: Of course. Indeed, we have relations and want to improve them.

Q: Why did you call the United States a terrorist state?

Chavez: The country is one thing — we have lovely relations with the people —
like in the Bronx [where Chavez paid a visit]. We have economic relations.
We have a company [Citgo, owned by the Venezuelan state oil company] that
refines 800,000 barrels of oil [daily] . . . We have 14,000 gas stations in
this country. We have sent Major League Baseball players here. We have many
ties between Venezuela and the United States — economic and social.

What I said is that this U.S. administration — the current government —
is a terrorist administration, not all U.S. governments. I entertained the
best of relations with the Clinton administration, and I consider myself a
good friend of former President Carter.

Q: So what's wrong with President Bush?

Chavez: This administration invaded Iraq. According to Pope John Paul II, it is
an illegal war, an immoral war, a terrorist war. The U.S. has bombarded
entire cities, used chemical weapons and napalm, killed women, children and
thousands of soldiers. That's terrorism.

In Venezuela they fostered a coup d'etat [in 2002] manufactured by the
CIA . . . Recently, Reverend Robertson called for my assassination. This is a
terrorist attack, according to international law. In Miami, on a daily
basis, people on TV shows are calling for my assassination. This is
terrorism.

This [present U.S.] government is a threat to humanity. I have
confidence that the American people will save humanity from this government
— they will not allow it to [continue to] violate human rights and to invade
countries.

Q: Reportedly, one of your best friends is Cuba's Fidel Castro. Is that
true?

Chavez: He is one of my best friends.

Q: Why do you admire him?

Chavez: I admire many things about Fidel. I think the world admires Fidel for
many reasons. His valor, his courage, the way he has led the revolution for
more than 40 years — in spite of a blockade and an embargo. Fidel is going
be 80 very soon, but this guy is filled with vitality. I have never met a
leader who is so well informed about what is going on in the world as well
as in his own country as is Fidel. He is totally devoted to solving people's
problems: health, education and work. Just to give you an idea, Cuba used to
produce a lot of sugar. Now, as a result of economic crisis and the fall of
the Soviet Union, they had to shut down 70 or 80 sugar production centers.
But Fidel found a way that this would not lead to unemployment in Cuba. He
invented a number of solutions to preserve the jobs of the Cubans.

For me, he is an exemplary friend, filled with a lot of solidarity. Do
you know how many Cuban doctors we have in Venezuela today? We have 20,000
Cuban doctors. In Africa there are thousands of Cuban doctors and more in
Central America, Asia and India.

Now we are conducting Operation Miracle, saving the eyesight of
thousands of Latin Americans through eye surgery. I call upon all U.S.
citizens — especially the poor — who happen to have eye problems that
require surgery. Cuba and Venezuela are offering to pay all expenses so
anyone can undergo surgery for eye diseases. Today, we signed an agreement
to train 200,000 doctors in the next 10 years. This information is denied to
U.S. citizens.

Q: Who would you like to see as president of the United States?

Chavez: I could deal with President Bush. I would like very much to be able to
debate issues with him. I would like to transform this confrontation, this
aggressive rhetoric, into a mature, serious debate on common issues. With
President Clinton, we were able to sit and talk. But with this
administration, it is impossible to talk because they want to impose things
on you. If Mr. Bush changes his procedures and approaches, it would be
excellent to talk and discuss current issues.

Regarding who is in the White House, it's up to you, the American
people. Think it over. A government with so much power that it can start a
war and destabilize a country but doesn't take care of its own people. Now,
before the hurricane, they knew that Katrina was coming, and the government
did not evacuate people. In Cuba, when they know a hurricane is coming,
chickens, hens and people are all evacuated. A hurricane recently destroyed
many towns in Cuba but not a single person died because no one was there.
The government prepared its people and took them to shelters, whereas here
they left the poor without protection, especially the blacks. That's
horrible. Be careful with the government you have.

Q: Reportedly, Venezuela is buying MiG planes, as well as rifles, from
Russia. Why does Venezuela need these?

Chavez: Who told you that I am going to buy MiGs? I am going to buy rifles,
that's true. Our rifles are very old. Venezuela does not have spare parts or
the workshops to maintain our equipment. It is high time for us to replace
our old rifles. We could not buy rifles from the Americans because of the
poor relations we have. We did not like what they had to offer in Europe
because of the prices. We liked the Russian rifles. They are to defend our
country. We are threatened by the empire.

Q: Is the US the empire?

Chavez: The government of the United States, that's the empire. We have evidence
that there are plans in this country to invade Venezuela. There is a plan
called "Balboa." Our intelligence found this plan, and everything is spelled
out there - the target is Venezuela. They have even calculated how many
bombings they should do, how many soldiers they will require. We now have
the counter-Balboa plan. I hope that this will never happen because you're
going to regret it. There will be such havoc in the whole hemisphere if this
happens. The United States invaded Iraq, but Venezuela is not Iraq. The
price of oil would shoot up and reach what — $100 a barrel?

Q: Experts in Washington claim you are encouraging radical groups
throughout Latin America — that you're helping the FARC in Colombia, Daniel
Ortega in Nicaragua, Shafik Handal and the FMLN in El Salvador, and Evo
Morales and the MAS in Bolivia.

Chavez: Shafik is a great friend. We are together in this same revolutionary
effort, of course. Shafik is a deputy member of the National Assembly, the
[FMLN is] a legal party in El Salvador. Daniel Ortega is a close friend, and
I think he will be a candidate in the next election. He is a great guy, very
intelligent. Evo Morales is my friend, another great guy and an Indian
leader. The parties they represent have excellent relations with my party.
Do you want me to support the extreme right wing? I am a revolutionary. I
have to support the left-wing movements in Latin America. We have to change
Latin America.

Q: Would you like to see these countries modeled on Cuba?

Chavez: No country is going to copy any model. Cuba is Cuba and is based on its
own circumstances. Latin American today is going to the left and not to the
right.

Q: In America, people believe in protecting minority rights and in a free
press. What about the Sumate members who are on trial in your country?

Chavez: Never before have we had so many political groups participate in the
elections and debates in Venezuela — right wing, left wing, center, radical
left, radical right. They organize demonstrations and meetings; they go to
the media: on TV, on radio. Not only have we not shut down any media
[outlets] but, on the contrary, they have multiplied. . . . I doubt very
much that in any other country in the world, there is more freedom of speech
than in Venezuela. We will never jail a journalist in Venezuela because he
does not want to reveal his sources. Here, yes. You have a journalist in
jail here [New York Times reporter Judith Miller] because she did not want
to reveal her sources.

In my capacity as head of state, I cannot comment on the legal aspects
of the Sumate issue. It is true that they have been sued. But not only
Sumate, other people and groups that took part in the coup of 2002 . . .

Q: Weren't they merely gathering signatures for a referendum [against you
as allowed by law]?

Chavez: They did that as well and they lost.

Q: So, why were they indicted for that?

Chavez: I don't know if they are really going to be thrown in jail. We have a
judiciary and an attorney general. If I had to make the decision, from a
political standpoint I would prefer to ignore these people. We have evidence
that they took part in the coup before gathering the signatures — there is
proof that they took part in a conspiracy. It is up to the branches in power
to say what the decision is. It is not up to me to decide. In this country,
from President Bush downward, everyone is defending Sumate. Sumate became an
instrument of the U.S. government to intervene in Venezuela. I defend my
sovereignty and the sovereignty of my country.